Author Topic: Iranian spring  (Read 4701 times)

Offline Nefertiti

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Iranian spring
« on: December 31, 2017, 12:07:24 PM »
What the Hell Is Happening in Iran?
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2017/12/what-the-hell-is-happening-in-iran.html

I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline veritas

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #1 on: December 31, 2017, 02:28:39 PM »
Fake news ?

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2017, 04:46:17 PM »
Nope. It's really happening. It's on the mainstream media. Trump tweeted about it.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Georgesoros

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #3 on: December 31, 2017, 11:56:04 PM »
Iran is a very repressive society with clerics in control. It'll turn even more repressive.

Offline veritas

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2018, 02:11:40 AM »
Arab countries don't suddenly "protest" for "freedom"

False flag...

During the Mau Mau uprising in the 1950s, captured Mau Mau members who switched sides and specially trained British troops initiated the pseudo-gang concept to successfully counter Mau Mau. In 1960 Frank Kitson, (who was later involved in the Northern Irish conflict and is now a retired British General), published Gangs and Counter-gangs, an account of his experiences with the technique in Kenya; information included how to counter gangs and measures of deception, including the use of defectors, which brought the issue a wider audience.[citation needed]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_flag

Offline veritas

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2018, 02:27:51 AM »
In my studies I learnt that the general sequence of attacks will be Iraq, Iran --> Saudi Arabia. Puppet regimes in Iraq & Iran are easier for the US to establish airbases to seige Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia has oil & the US needs oil. US is in energy oil debt and has paid the Saudis with US land. For instance the Saudi govt owns 10% of US land.

The other problem is with a rising China but China are disadvantaged because they don't have shipping ports. 40% of China's oil comes through the North Korean peninsula/ports.

Iran, NK... these are small wars between China, Russia & Arabs.

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2018, 11:19:32 AM »
Most "uprising" is instigated by the US. The Arab Spring comes to mind. The ayatollahs are too smart to be overthrown by infiltration. They are the ones doing the infiltrating now in the region. They have successfully thwarted a takeover in Syria and Yemen, and in Iraq they are very influential. After the Ukraine Russia is not about to let any uprising succeed.

The videos of protests are true but there are bigger counter-protests. They won't succeed against the entrenched state machinery.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline veritas

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #7 on: January 01, 2018, 02:52:02 PM »
The Arab Spring didn't result in +ve changes. It instead set the scene for Arab Winter ie. genocides. War instigated protests for the purposes of establishing puppet regimes- rarely last. True democracy is a home grown theocratic transition to become better human beings. It's a reflection of a population achieving milestones towards an enlightened society - Marx. Such things can't be bought and it certainly can't be rushed. At its basic, it needs to be authentically grassroots.

If the USA cared so much about retaining their superpower status they really ought to fix their own country starting with their political model. Redistribute wealth, a new tax system, promote small businesses, more support systems etc. abolish left/right politics which is perhaps one thing Trump can be credited for. I generally think of USA as a povo nation because it lacks a moral compass, people are so divided by race and everything else. It's really just a matter of time before the place becomes the quintessential tourism nation for homelessness. Marx made it clear communism is inevitable - the final political model towards an enlightened society (not one under an authoritarian rule like Stalin and North Korea). I see communism manifest in the USA by way of homeless communities sharing free resources etc. If Marx is correct then homelessness will be prevalent in the USA. I just hope it won't come so sudden it ends up like a Zombie apocalypse where people shoot each other and the currency exchange revolves around serums of all sorts ruled by scientists.

Offline Georgesoros

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2018, 03:11:50 PM »
The Arab Spring didn't result in +ve changes. It instead set the scene for Arab Winter ie. genocides. War instigated protests for the purposes of establishing puppet regimes- rarely last. True democracy is a home grown theocratic transition to become better human beings. It's a reflection of a population achieving milestones towards an enlightened society - Marx. Such things can't be bought and it certainly can't be rushed. At its basic, it needs to be authentically grassroots.
I agree. Libya was once stable but nowadays its a terrorist haven. Egypt almost went terror. Syria is a killing field.  Yemen is a cholera stricken region. Theres no positive thing in destabilizing Iran.

Offline veritas

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2018, 03:17:56 PM »
Yep, they won't succeed with Iran because Iranians are different to Iraqis and other Arab nations. They're educated, Western savvy, much more worldly and have already accommodated for democratic changes in their culture to hopefully counteract foreign intrusions.

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2018, 05:50:10 PM »
I see am not the solo perturbed by American homelessness in the midst of affluence.

Iran is a pseudo-democracy with grassroots meritocracy. The president, parliament, mayors, etc belong to parties and are elected. They have to maintain the theocracy to wade off western infiltration and sabotage as happened under the shah. China would have been sabotaged too without the Party's firm grip on the state. There are numerous cases of CIA saboteurs in Tibet.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Kichwa

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #11 on: January 01, 2018, 07:32:29 PM »
Trump's support for the uprising is not going to be helpful either. I wish Trump would just shut-up on things he knows nothing about.

I see am not the solo perturbed by American homelessness in the midst of affluence.

Iran is a pseudo-democracy with grassroots meritocracy. The president, parliament, mayors, etc belong to parties and are elected. They have to maintain the theocracy to wade off western infiltration and sabotage as happened under the shah. China would have been sabotaged too without the Party's firm grip on the state. There are numerous cases of CIA saboteurs in Tibet.
"I have done my job and I will not change anything dead or a live" Malonza

Offline Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #12 on: January 01, 2018, 07:56:11 PM »
Trump's support for the uprising is not going to be helpful either. I wish Trump would just shut-up on things he knows nothing about.

I see am not the solo perturbed by American homelessness in the midst of affluence.

Iran is a pseudo-democracy with grassroots meritocracy. The president, parliament, mayors, etc belong to parties and are elected. They have to maintain the theocracy to wade off western infiltration and sabotage as happened under the shah. China would have been sabotaged too without the Party's firm grip on the state. There are numerous cases of CIA saboteurs in Tibet.

Pretty much everything bar grabbing them by the pussy.  If the US is on the decline, Trump has put it into turbo boost.
"I freed a thousand slaves.  I could have freed a thousand more if only they knew they were slaves."

Harriet Tubman

Offline Kichwa

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #13 on: January 01, 2018, 08:58:46 PM »
I still have hope for America to be great again unless they re-elect Trump. I would like to think Trump was just a bad mistake and America has learned and will never repeat it again.

Trump's support for the uprising is not going to be helpful either. I wish Trump would just shut-up on things he knows nothing about.

I see am not the solo perturbed by American homelessness in the midst of affluence.

Iran is a pseudo-democracy with grassroots meritocracy. The president, parliament, mayors, etc belong to parties and are elected. They have to maintain the theocracy to wade off western infiltration and sabotage as happened under the shah. China would have been sabotaged too without the Party's firm grip on the state. There are numerous cases of CIA saboteurs in Tibet.

Pretty much everything bar grabbing them by the pussy.  If the US is on the decline, Trump has put it into turbo boost.
"I have done my job and I will not change anything dead or a live" Malonza

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #14 on: January 01, 2018, 10:13:00 PM »
Trump's mantra is to make America great again. There's paradox in there somewhere.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Kichwa

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #15 on: January 02, 2018, 12:05:22 AM »
Ironically is going through the same rough experience of horrible ethnic centric leadership which has divided a nation in a way its never been divided before. With America there is a lot of hope it will come back together peacefully after Trump.

Trump's mantra is to make America great again. There's paradox in there somewhere.
"I have done my job and I will not change anything dead or a live" Malonza

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #16 on: January 02, 2018, 07:18:08 AM »
Kichwa I think the US/western Left vs Right politics is an exact Jubilee vs NASA redux where each claims the other is tribal. Looking at the Russiagate shenanigans - the allegations of collusion - the unprofessionalism. The politicization of the justice system makes the US a banana republic. I used to read about Chinese executions with horror but am not so sure any more about the US. Justice depends on your party.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #17 on: January 02, 2018, 01:31:55 PM »
Kichwa I think the US/western Left vs Right politics is an exact Jubilee vs NASA redux where each claims the other is tribal. Looking at the Russiagate shenanigans - the allegations of collusion - the unprofessionalism. The politicization of the justice system makes the US a banana republic. I used to read about Chinese executions with horror but am not so sure any more about the US. Justice depends on your party.

I do see strong similarities between Trump supporters and the jubilated faction in Kenya.  And yes,  el Trumpo is working hard to upend the architecture of the US justice system.  Only Mueller and a disinterested Republican Congress stands in his way.

But a more worrying danger is North Korea.  The US and NK are now both in the hands of certified lunatics.
"I freed a thousand slaves.  I could have freed a thousand more if only they knew they were slaves."

Harriet Tubman

Offline Kichwa

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #18 on: January 02, 2018, 02:16:02 PM »
Kichwa I think the US/western Left vs Right politics is an exact Jubilee vs NASA redux where each claims the other is tribal. Looking at the Russiagate shenanigans - the allegations of collusion - the unprofessionalism. The politicization of the justice system makes the US a banana republic. I used to read about Chinese executions with horror but am not so sure any more about the US. Justice depends on your party.

I do see strong similarities between Trump supporters and the jubilated faction in Kenya.  And yes,  el Trumpo is working hard to upend the architecture of the US justice system.  Only Mueller and a disinterested Republican Congress stands in his way.

But a more worrying danger is North Korea.  The US and NK are now both in the hands of certified lunatics.
"I have done my job and I will not change anything dead or a live" Malonza

Offline Georgesoros

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Re: Iranian spring
« Reply #19 on: January 02, 2018, 03:45:50 PM »
Kichwa I think the US/western Left vs Right politics is an exact Jubilee vs NASA redux where each claims the other is tribal. Looking at the Russiagate shenanigans - the allegations of collusion - the unprofessionalism. The politicization of the justice system makes the US a banana republic. I used to read about Chinese executions with horror but am not so sure any more about the US. Justice depends on your party.

I do see strong similarities between Trump supporters and the jubilated faction in Kenya.  And yes,  el Trumpo is working hard to upend the architecture of the US justice system.  Only Mueller and a disinterested Republican Congress stands in his way.

But a more worrying danger is North Korea.  The US and NK are now both in the hands of certified lunatics.

YAP!! n Kenya we have tribalism, while in USA its racism. rump tapped into these crowd while many right minded people were sleeping. Rightly so he will be unable to maintain the momentum and is losing heavily. In Kenya, many people go tribal.